Guns in Schools?: Campus Concealed Carry

These people with heads full of screwed up wiring go where they know no one can stop them.
This has been proven over and again, you limit the kill fields, it will cut down the acts.
Guns on well trained civilians have proven their self worth in these situations, only stumbling blind man couldn’t see this. The sad part is the people who control the laws, refuse to do anything about it. So the next time some wing nut goes into a school or miliatry building or shopping place and murders somebody. The politicians of that area should be held for the crime, as an accomplice to the fact, they knew about it, but refused to do anything. IMHO

Protect the kids, stop the politics and defend our kids. Do it right and do it now, you can’t stop head cases trying we can stop them succeeding.

Two thoughts on this.  First, the proponents of these measures have an uphill battle to fight.  Our colleges and universities seem to have little respect for the 1st Amendment Rights of students in the manner in which they have discriminated against religious and political expression(at least those they don’t agree with) and campus speech codes.    They(Administrators and teachers unions) are not going to be open to the idea of students exercising their 2nd Amendment Rights on campus either.
Second,  A agree that concealed carry should be permitted on campus grounds not in order to shoot it out with an armed nutcase, but because the presence of lawfully armed students on campus will probably eliminate colleges and universities from the killers target list.  They simply won’t be able to predict who is armed and where they might run into an armed student when they try to plan their murderous rampage.

As a teacher of one of the largest schools in suburban Chicago, I can tell you that arming/allowing concealed carry in the school will never happen, or at least not in my tenure.  Majority of administrators are liberals who are against any type of armed individuals in the schools.  They won’t allow dogs cause it will cast a bad shadow for those in charge.  At any point, in my school, a person off the street can walk into the school.  We have some 27 exit doors and no way those can be covered at all times.  we have almost 4,000 students.  We have random searches of person probably once every few months.  
I am not for arming the faculty cause most would not be able to hit their target if they tried. In addition most are strongly against guns and would refuse to allow teachers to carry in school.  
Heck you can’t suspend a student for hitting a teacher if they have an IEP.  We had a special ed student bring a gun last spring and he was back here in the fall.  
I wish i could carry or have my carbine with me but that will never happen.

I enjoy my firearms as much if not more than most but to be honest the thought of some person who has had the minimal training shooting while under stress at someone when I am in the room scares the hell outta me. If most police officers do not hit their targets and they have training and are accustomed to the stress of conflict then what makes you think that someone who does not can save the day? I am ex-military and was taught and had to fire under stress, am not so sure how accurate I would be now. Stress shooting is a perishable skill and the ones who think they would have no problem, well, are wrong. Shooting paper is very different from drawing down on someone. I hate to be mean (ok maybe not) but I do not go to pub;lic ranges because I have seen way to many people there mishandling their weapon while trying to show off etc. I have a membership at a private range for that reason. The ones that have training such as ex-military or LE are more acceptable as they have been trained and no I am not talking about people who just filed papers or helped you sign up for leave. 
 If you think this through and look at many of the people you see with CCW’s you know there is a strong chance you would not allow them to park your car. I shoot weekly but that does not make me accurate when someone is shooting back at me.
Anyone who has seen combat or had someone shoot at them knows having someone return fire is much different from shooting paper or steel targets.

triathlete98 mike96256  
Thanks I am just waiting for the barrage of hate mail I will get for that comment.!  Everyone thinks they know how they will handle these things but you know as well as I that the level of stress involving a shooting changes everything. Heart rate increases, vision narrows as the fear and adrenaline increase and that changes everything in regards to shot placement, trigger control etc. I was scared to unbelievable degree when someone was shooting at me and yes it does get better over time and you do develop an ability to tune it out but this is not something most ccw holders experience. The people that scare me the most are the ones who just think they will see the threat and fire 3 rounds center mass and it will be done! Nope don’t work that way.

 I have a daughter who is in kindergarten and I do not know what a good answer is but giving her teacher a gun is one I am not sure of. If you do then they have to go through serious training and no not just the basic ccw course. 
 I have trained in mixed martial arts for years and I taught a self defense class and most people will recoil and loose the ability defend themselves. This is at least until they get accustomed to having someone hit them or even put their hands on them.
Anyway – thanks for the positive response.

triathlete98 mike96256  
I am not surprised in the least by this as it is for the most part human nature to not want to get involved in a situation where you can get injured. Look at how many instances where people are being beaten and people just watch or fail to call for help. Having training goes a long way to solve that problem as it helps a person feel more confident in their abilities and thus over ride the fear to some degree.  I believe even with training that it still takes a certain type of person who is willing to risk injury and goes into a situation unarmed or put themselves out there when there is an active shooter.

I believe most people want to rely on someone else to keep them safe and will snipe from the side lines about how this or that should be done. I have several friends in LE and one was involved in a shooting where he was shot at and people commented that he should have shot the guy in the leg. The only thing that saved my friend was that the persons weapon jammed. 
 As I said I do not know what the answer is as my wife is a professor and I would not trust her colleagues with anything more than a butter knife. I know this is harsh but it is a fact.
Good for you that are willing to put yourself out there where others will not. Be careful as will be seen as that aggressive guy who likes the violence. lol

mike96256 opps to late for that, lol.  I have been on the carpet so many times.  Good thing I am good at what I do otherwise they’d have gotten rid of me a long time ago.

I’m not going to hate on you. I am going to disagree with your views.
Keeping schools as a gun free zone (GFZ) is the wrong type of thinking. I’m not a teacher or in anyway attached to any school, but anyone who has the desire to become a CCW holder means that they understand that they are at least going to try to protect themselves if not their charges. In the case of Ohio the first Buckeye Firearm Association (BFA) class held a pro bono CCW/School Defense class for school staff. The BFA and NRA also worked with the Ohio legislature to at least make the school GFZ zones a local issue. (As much as I prefer state level preemption, but another argument.)
One of the first classes found three teachers and a mid-level admin in the same class from the same school. They went back to the local school board to take  out the the GFZ and had support from the local population.

So I am not saying that there are many people who should not CCW. But painting so many with a broad brush like this is not necessarily right. And many people who are right leaning in the education system just keep their mouths shut many times. When you’re the minority you try not to attract attention.

Jim,
 I understand what you are saying and yes I am painting CCW holders with a broad brush because you cannot deny most people who own firearms shoot them rarely. The fact is that if most police officers do not hit their target or trained military (ok maybe with a bunch of rounds). My point is stress shooting is something different completely from putting holes in paper. That if you are going to carry a handgun in my daughters school then I want you out there doing 3 gun competitions and getting realistic training with paintball or less than lethal ammo. Sitting around at your local gun shop talking about how you would have reacted is of little value in the real world (see mall ninja’s). You only learn to deal with the stress with training and being put in as close of an approximation to the actual event as you can. 
Think about how people react when they are hit in anger? Most people start swinging wildly and miss the person who hit them and why, because they are not in that situation often or they do not train realistically.
I would much rather have a uniformed officer who has been on streets and who has had to confront someone who wants to hurt them than someone who attends a class but does not train regularly.